And, while people believe that they are truly following God and doing God's work, many of them will accept the unacceptable, often without question. This is why there has to be ongoing debate and critique of religions.

part of religions power comes from its position, presenting itself as being unquestionable. questioning is often even a sin, and this can be for no other reason than it being a political edifice protecting itself from the erosive effects of inquiring minds. now that people can be brave enough to question, i really do think religions days are numbered. it won't go overnight, but i would be surprised if religion laste another 500 years.

but then i'd be surprised if mankind lasts that long...

Religion?
Mankind?

Who can say?

You know after all of this talk about "Religion" I can't recall one time in the last three years when any of my dedicants or elders have referred to our practice as a "Religion"??

Just to continue this strange conversation can you guys tell me exactly what, without referring to some idiotic definition from the internet, a religion is? What is religion? What constitutes the creation and continuation of a religion?

If you worship SOMETHING are you a member of a religion or is it more than that? If I took a notion to worhip Elvis Presley would I be a member of a religion?

I ask this not to be an arse but at this point I am not sure if I am a member of a religion or not because though I equate my group's activities with that of the Druids not one of them have ever came forth and actually said that we are of Druidic Decent thus I just assumed.

OK so without an official title and only practices for me to stand on what do you have to say about my work and practice?

Hi Mongrel

Your comments reminded me of earlier conversation on this site ~ and elsewhere ~ where people said that they were not religious, but that they were Christians. Indeed, many Christians were offended by the term 'religion'.

But, to me, yes, a religion is simply where a god / gods / similar are believed in / worshipped / prayed to. If someone decided that Elvis were (a) god, and decided to worship him, then I would consider that a religion.

hahahah... yep, i remember that doozie. that was a year or two ago. many religious people do not like to be known as such. bizarre, but then cops don't like to be called fascists (have direct experience there), bureaucrats don't like being called retarded, and bankers don't like being called &*$£'s - don't mean they aint. if it involves belief in deities, its a religion. except the really silly ones like scientology and satanism which are wannabe religions. lol.

Most atheists take the direct path to Deus ex machina and imply that there absolutely is no higher power available, that it's all smoke and mirrors, but I don't detect that in you janimal nor you PDM. I was lying of course as though we don't say it we all know it and we practice it with prudence and artistry - each generation just a little more obsessive than the last and to what end? Well I think that's just the answer - THE END.

Someone made a post on here a few days ago called "Do you meditate" or something like that and I bring this up because it coincides with something Janimal stated:

"part of religions power comes from its position, presenting itself as being unquestionable. questioning is often even a sin, and this can be for no other reason than it being a political edifice protecting itself from the erosive effects of inquiring minds."

and he is quite right. How many world religions are just that - WORLD RELIGIONS because their followers are not allowed to question their religion? I was stuck in a church for over thirty years that stood on a book rewritten by a mass murdering genocidist who cheated on his wife up until his death. My current "religion" encourages input from members including a practice called "Communing with the Dead". We have a private graveyard on our family property where we go to talk to our ancestors and "meditate" on our practices in order to improve them. In thirty years not so much as even the time of services changed in my previous "religion" so I see where you are coming from Janimal.


I am really tired so I think the bed is callin my name. Please all have a pleasant night.

I don't think that it is any of my business what people believe ~ that is unless and until it causes suffering and pain to others.

Families fall out over beliefs. Kids are taunted and bullied over religious beliefs, or lack thereof. Children suffer fear of hell and the like.

People die for religion. Wars are fought. Martyrs allow themselves to suffer. People are murdered because of religion ~ even family members.

That is not good or healthy.

yep, and thats why its all got to go.

interesting you should bring up meditation, mongrel. to me this is not a religious practise, in fact it has been proved that advance states of meditation such as those achieved by yogis or sadhus bring about massive increases in brain activity and actually mapo out new neural pathways.

i don't get into the higher power conversation often, especially lately that i have become convinced that god lives in the brain, as this makes the higher power question a mute point. to me the highest power in your life is yourself, and something that i object to in most religions is the idea of submission to a higher power. i am a great believer in the power of the individual, and i think this is actually a much healthier and more progressive standpoint instead of putting your faith in a 'theoretical' entity which may or may not provide answers.

if religion was for real then this reality would be self evident. to me all the taboo about questioning religion is proof to the contrary.

the bottom line is that belief is a personal matter and it is of little consequence until it starts to inhibit peoples freedom of choice (ie kids growing up in religion) and causes people to be crappy to each other. that is where i start to take offense at the whole edifice, and the harm it does to the progression of the human race.

as bill and ted said, be excellent to one another.

Yes, but have you noticed how, for some people, the 'truth' of religion really seems to be extremely self-evident?